Choice of tenants - who would you pick...if any?

[chickpea]

Out of the viewings the property has had, the agent has advvised us that one couple were not suitable for us (the couple were delibrately vague about whether they had small children or not, and the agent felt they were hiding things from them).

We have 2 parties that want the property -

1/ single man, 28, who owns a gym.

2/ Romanian couple who have been in the country since last summer. Both work in a local restaurant. They have rented with the agent previously and were good tenants, apparently sorting out problems when the other couple they were renting with did a runner - this couple managed to sort out the missing rent etc.

Do either of these parties strike you as potentially ok tenants - or would you carry on looking?

Our concerns are that the single bloke may only be able to provide references for himself - ie proof of earnings, employer references- since he's self-employed. Also, is a single (youngish) chap more likely to leave the place a tip?

As far as the couple go, we need to find out how long their work permit is for. Should we be concerned about the language barrier, and what happens if they disappear back to Romania???

I think Richlist has said in the past that he'd never have tenants for whom English isn't their first language.

It is some reassurance that the agent has already filtered out one potentially probelmatic set of tenants, and that they have knowledge of previous form from the Romanian couple, but we're still not sure what to do.

Any advice?

[Carryon Regardless]

I generally prefer single guys to single girls as at least the guy is there to be assessed. With a female T there is likelihood that guys will become involved and cannot be assessed.

A Gym owner has obvious risks if things don't go to 'your' plan, you have some experience of the threatening from previous Daddy.

Different cultures come with different understandings, I have rented to Polish and Chech. They aren't really any different but the "it doesn't work like that where we come" has been used on me.

How will you overcome the issue of G'tor? Claiming from anyone overseas isn't something I'd fancy. How can a satisfactory history / credit check be carried out?

[chickpea]

That's a really good point about single men versus single women - I would have said single women everytime, but you're right...you don't get to assess the "other half".

In actual fact, this chap is going through divorce so perhaps no other half as yet.

We've spoken to the agent again this morning, concerning the Romanians. He is very happy with them, from his experience - they will have references from both this agent and their current landlord, plus employees (the agent has already spoken to them, concerning work permits/visas etc). I should say, for what it's worth, that this agent is on the sniff for potentail trouble - not only has he weeded out the other couple, but he also suspected something odd when he got an email about the property yesterday, and it turned out to be from the single-mother-no-job-living-on-benefits that hounded us last time. He is very happy with the Romanian couple from his previous dealings with them - in his words, they are excellent tenants.

So, for now, we have decided to go ahead with checks and references and may solve the guarantoor issue by perhaps asking for a slightly increased deposit, if possible.

Clearly, credit checks would be helpful - but the last tenants' references and checks came back fine...and now we know they were council tax dodgers, among other things :S

[Richlist]

I think Richlist has said in the past that he'd never have tenants for whom English isn't their first language.

You have misunderstood my previous post Tracey. I didn't suggest that I don't take tenants for whom English isn't their first lannguage. I don't really care if English is their first or fifth language.....what I do is I make sure ANY potential tenant can speak English sufficiently well to have a normal conversation.....many from overseas fail.....and if you can't hold a normal conversation the ttenancy will be a disaster.

Thats a really good point about single men versus single women - I would have said single women everytime, but you're right...you don't get to assess the "other half".

In actual fact, this chap is going through divorce so perhaps no other half as yet.

It may or may not be a good point but its only ONE opinion and one that I'd disagree with. I find women tenants far better than men....tidier, cleaner and easier to deal with generally. Although I have let to a few single men who have been incredibly tidy and well behaved. Women & men are equally likely to move a partner in with them. The fact that the guy is single is not a problem.

I dont really see a problem with either set of tenants provided they qualify for rent guarantee insurance &/or a home owning guarantor and pass all the checks, balances and other items on my list.

[chickpea]

I couldn't remember what you'd said exactly, Rich - I knew it had something to do with language barriers.

I think Cor's observation about single men is an interesting one, and certainly one I hadn't considered. Hubby wants to opt for the couple for precisely the reasons you state - he thinks a woman in the house might mean it's kept clean and tidy (but again, that theory was disproved with our last tenants...)

I will check whether they qualify for rent guarantee insurance.

[Melboy]

I have a single man as a tenant. 7 years he has been in occupation with absolutely no problems whatsoever.

Romanian couple? I would need a lot of persuading and a lot of pre-checking to make me convinced that these people would be suitable tenants for my property.... but hey! ho! that's me.

Mel.

[Richlist]

Yes.......the Sacha Barron Cohen character......Borat ......springs to mind.

[Carryon Regardless]

RL my reasoning, and experience.

Male views the property and you can see who you will get, any future female involvement might involve an aggressive attitude but is 'less' likely to be potentially violent. Females are more likely to sir up from the back seat but leave the male to take responsibility for a situation, and as T they would be anyway.

Female views you see her. Males chase and attempt to impress females with enthusiasm. A potential future male is more likely to wish to demonstrate his ability to negotiate, here there is an increased potential for violence, or at least threats of. There hasn't been opportunity for him to be assessed for the tenancy and he could feasibly be the owner of a gym, or at least claim to be.

When a male views if I perceive an aggressive attitude, or the potential for aggressive response, he goes no further. My imagination sees a future situation where a 6' 2" 15 stone limited IQ individual has to be approached over some negative situation, it would take a lot of profit to make that desirable.

This is more applicable to, but not restricted to, the lower end of the market.

[davidmargolies]

Well there seems to be a lot of speculation going on around the topic of keeping a tenant. I think language barriers or being a male or a female hardly gives any idea of a tenant to be a good one or a bad one. I would recommend a thorough background check of the tenants, as this is the most logical solution for your query. There are services like "Tenant Approve" which can provide you with customized reports regarding the background checks of the tenants or in your case credit check reports of the tenants.

I think you should leave no room for any kind of assumptions as this can hamper your business if you get a problem tenant.

[Melboy]

Yes.......the Sacha Barron Cohen character......Borat ......springs to mind.

[Grampa]

If the tenant is self employed ask for his last 3 years set of accounts to prove income. Also get a guarentor.

It isnt unsual to ask for a larger deposit from self employed tenants as well.

[Richlist]

Well there seems to be a lot of speculation going on around the topic of keeping a tenant. I think language barriers or being a male or a female hardly gives any idea of a tenant to be a good one or a bad one.

I don't think anybody is suggesting that the limited attributes you mention should be the only selection criteria.

BUT, I can pretty much guarantee that most referencing/ tenant background checks will not identify the applicants ability to hold a conversation in English nor many of the other detailed selection criteria that I & many others require.

[Mortitia]

Going back to Tracey's original question - I think I might keep looking.

I would check out how busy the restaurant was where the Romanians work and consider them further since they did get themselves out of debt but would discount the self employed gym owner.

I look for 2 working persons - ideally in different companies to limit the risks. What amazes me is that agents will send along anyone despite my instructions to the contrary.

Currently I am tenant hunting using a new to me agent. Yesterday agent turned up at my office with a young, unemployed woman who has a mixed race child and is waiting for a major surgical operation and a shady guarantor (who owns a third of a bar in Ibiza allegedly but does not work). I want to let to 2 young professionals my 2 bed 2 bath flat and I don't see applicants at my office!

Is agent taking the p****?

Mortitia

[Melboy]

Nice one Mortitia......

In spite of your strict criteria for tenant finding here we find yet again an LA who has s**t for brains.

What's up with them then? Do they just not listen to anything a landlord requests by way of a tenant?

[Richlist]

I've had similar experience.

I found that there were two major reasons for this when it happened to me :-

1. Most landlords the LA will be dealing with are ONLY iinterested in letting their property. They don't provide a tenant specification and don't care to much who becomes the tenant provided they receive their rent. Therefore you, ( & the rest of us on this site) are atypical of their normal punter........and they are just not used to dealing with such proactive landlords.

2. The LA often employ young, inexerienced, unqualified trainees who are not properly supervised or instructed and they will occasional deal with your property.

Now you know the issues you can fix it quickly.

[Mortitia]

Yes, I agree Richlist.

Another worrying scenario is that my contract with the agent is for a 1 off payment and no recurring charges.

Therefore IMO they keep the best tenants or direct them to properties they are managing so they take max money on renewals and charging tenants every 6 months an admin fee.

Yesterday in a walk down the High St where this particular rental is I counted 14 estate/letting agents - way too many for the area.

Mortitia

[Melboy]

Yesterday in a walk down the High St where this particular rental is I counted 14 estate/letting agents - way too many for the area.

Mortitia

Sounds like Waterlooville Nr. Portsmouth Mortitia.... 14 EA's and LA's all within spitting distance of one another. How they all make a living is quite beyond me.

Mel.

[Mortitia]

Maybe this is typical of the south at the moment but this was in Southbourne, a suburb of Bournemouth but like you I don't see how they can all make a living apart from ripping off landlord and tenant.

Additionally I put an ad on Gumtree and was inundated with agents from up to 7 miles away wanting to put it on their books.

Complete madness. All I want is a pair of working tenants!

Mortitia

[Richlist]

We have to remember :

* That nationwide lots of estate agents have closed/ folded/disappeared.

* Those that can, now focus on lettings rather than sales.

* The lettings market is enormous.

* The number of HB tenants is growing almost exponentially.

* Legislation introduced during the past few years have generated lots of additional potential revenue streams for agents eg deposit protection, inventories etc

* Agents have the opportunity of paying employees low basic salaries with the rest based on pay for performance.

* High street commercial property is not necessarily in high demand so attractive lease renewals can often be negotiatted.

etc etc

[Grampa]

In my expierence being a letting agent and doing the job properly doesnt yield high profits. That why you start seeing all these extra fees (a lot hidden in the small print) that some agents are charging. I cannot see a agent who charges under 10% without numerous extra charges doing a good job.

Estate agency is by far more profitable and by far a lot less work for your buck. But with the highs and lows of the property market there is no guaranteed income so you get estate agents playing at letting agents in the lean times and doing a poor job of it giving letting agents a bad name. I can have one staff member generate the same income on sales in a month that it that 3 1/2 others to do on lettings.

I am sure there are loads of people out there will say "but I use a estate agent to let & manage my property" without problems, but it is when the problems/issues arrise you find out how good they are.