sorry for double post

[groovywhale]

Hello.

Just a few questions - Judging by the following photographs do you think that this property would pass health and safety regulations fit for rental?

Judging from these photographs could the landlord gain a valid electrical landlords safety certificate for the property?

The reason I ask is that the landlord is delaying on a reference for us to move properties. The initial argument was that we owe another months rent before we can leave, however aa check to the bank shows that we have been paying in advance, not arrears and are fully up to date with all payments.

I am genuinely interested in your thoughts of the property and how legal/fit it appears from these photos. Thanks for your help!

PICS

[Richlist]

Did you move into the property in this condition ?

Have you written to the landlord detailing your issues and asking him to carry out repairs ?

Have you contacted the Environmental Health Dept of your local Council about the issues ?

The property looks dreadfull BUT......It seems to me that you are making the classic mistake of using another issue (that of the electrical safety/ fitness of the property) to counter the delayed reference & claim for unpaid rent being made by your landlord......the world of letting doesn't work like that.

These are TWO separate issues that need to be dealt with SEPARATELY. You cannot use your argument to force the original issue. In fact.....this is exactly the way that my partner conducts an argument. We have a disagreement and then my partner drags up another totally unrelated issue in an attempt to win the original disagreement. Its playground politics and never works.

Landlords refusing to provide references is an everyday occourance and doesn't normally stop tenants from moving.

Deal with the rent payments first......provide copies of bank statements to the landlord as proof of payment.

[Melboy]

Everything Richlist has stated especially the last sentence on proof of payments to landlord.

What is actually going on there then? Are the improvements being carried out whilst you are in occupation or did you accept the property on a tenancy in that condition? Very odd.

The photo's of the switches and light fitting could be rectified in 10 minutes but of course even fixed to the wall and ceiling doesn't guarantee you a certificate as the check is more comprehensive than what we are looking at.

Mel.

[groovywhale]

Hello. All payments are totally up to date and the landlord has been told of this. Since this point the landlord has switched off the mobile phone and is completely non-contactable. It seems simply spiteful because they could not wangle another months rent out of me legally. I NEED a reference from them to move out of this dump and into somewhere complete.

My point of mixing matters is that if they do not provide me a reference for me, I intend to repay the favour in kind by reporting them to whomever I can.

The property was much worse than this when we moved in, they said that it would only require two weeks of work to fix (before we moved in) and so we moved into the house (to find it in a complete state). We moved in on Feb 2011. It is now of course October 2011.

Also, they said that they did me a favour: I registered with the Council to pay tax on the property in October 2010, believing that I would soon be moving in. Do to problems with the property (you can see them) I was not able to move until Feb 2011. They said that they had to pay council tax during this period and that that was unfair. I have paid all bills since the move in date and am even in credit . I have not been a bad tenant.

To make the issue more clear, this was a private let via friends who have a number of properties and decided to let to me. We do have a tenancy agreement. Due to my recent complaints they have dropped all contact with me. I have been living with my new wife like this for far too long, and they seem to be rather upset with us that we intend to leave. I assums that no legit agent would touch the property and we have been paying off their mortgage on the property quite nicely.

I did not agree to move into an unfinished property, and I feel as if I have been taken advantage of. The fact that they cannot even provide me with the courtesy of a reference is boiling my blood; the lack of contact even more so.

[groovywhale]

Hello. All payments are totally up to date and the landlord has been told of this. Since this point the landlord has switched off the mobile phone and is completely non-contactable. It seems simply spiteful because they could not wangle another months rent out of me legally. I NEED a reference from them to move out of this dump and into somewhere complete.

My point of mixing matters is that if they do not provide me a reference for me, I intend to repay the favour in kind by reporting them to whomever I can.

The property was much worse than this when we moved in, they said that it would only require two weeks of work to fix (before we moved in) and so we moved into the house (to find it in a complete state). We moved in on Feb 2011. It is now of course October 2011.

Also, they said that they did me a favour: I registered with the Council to pay tax on the property in October 2010, believing that I would soon be moving in. Do to problems with the property (you can see them) I was not able to move until Feb 2011. They said that they had to pay council tax during this period and that that was unfair. I have paid all bills since the move in date and am even in credit . I have not been a bad tenant.

To make the issue more clear, this was a private let via friends who have a number of properties and decided to let to me. We do have a tenancy agreement. Due to my recent complaints they have dropped all contact with me. I have been living with my new wife like this for far too long, and they seem to be rather upset with us that we intend to leave. I assums that no legit agent would touch the property and we have been paying off their mortgage on the property quite nicely.

I did not agree to move into an unfinished property, and I feel as if I have been taken advantage of. The fact that they cannot even provide me with the courtesy of a reference is boiling my blood; the lack of contact even more so.

PS the electric were done by a dodgy friend of a friend (of theirs) and certain lights do not work unless you also press other non related light switches. Basically, I do not entirely trust it.

[Richlist]

Well if you're not going to answer my questions I'm not going spend my time answering yours.

* Have you requested the landlord repair/ make good the defects IN WRITING ? and

* Have you contacted environmental health dept of your local council ?....especially now that we lean the electrics have been installed by amatuers.

I'm still none the wiser as to why you cannot move unless you get this landlords reference. Thats not how the world works normally.

As they say on Dragons Den ......I'm OUT!!!!!

[groovywhale]

Well if you're not going to answer my questions I'm not going spend my time answering yours.

* Have you requested the landlord repair/ make good the defects IN WRITING ? and

* Have you contacted environmental health dept of your local council ?....especially now that we lean the electrics have been installed by amatuers.

I'm still none the wiser as to why you cannot move unless you get this landlords reference. Thats not how the world works normally.

As they say on Dragons Den ......I'm OUT!!!!!

My main method of contact with them is via phone, which they have switched off, remember, these are meant to be "friends". I could write to them, but there is little point as they are very aware of the situation as it is. Very aware in deed.

No, I have not contacted the council, part of my reason for writing on this forum would be to see if I have any sort of case against anyone. So I will ask again - Would the council actually be able to take any action?

We are planning to move elsewhere, but the move has been put on hold whilst we are vetted via Letsure by our letting Agents. I am assuming (I am not a landlord) that without a valid reference that they will not process me much further.

As they say on Dragons Den, albeit very rarely and probably off-air "big hairy bollocks" :-D

xxx

[Melboy]

Mmmm! Tricky.....as they are friends, shortly to be ex-friends, then you must do as Richlist has advised you to do and that is to contact them in writing to their home address requesting a written reference. If they fail to produce one in 7 days then go and bring in the Council Inspection team who will take the Landlord to task and force him /her to sort out the problems. This is last resort though. If your landlord has any sense they will just let you go and do as you have requested.

Another classic case whereby, as we all recommend on this forum, never rent from or let to friends.......not that you have done anything wrong by your actions it would appear.

Mel.

[groovywhale]

Mmmm! Tricky.....as they are friends, shortly to be ex-friends, then you must do as Richlist has advised you to do and that is to contact them in writing to their home address requesting a written reference. If they fail to produce one in 7 days then go and bring in the Council Inspection team who will take the Landlord to task and force him /her to sort out the problems. This is last resort though. If your landlord has any sense they will just let you go and do as you have requested.

Another classic case whereby, as we all recommend on this forum, never rent from or let to friends.......not that you have done anything wrong by your actions it would appear.

Mel.

Thanks for the tips Melboy. They are still not helping us out and have ceased all lines of communication. Letsure is trying to obtain the reference directly, so it is out of our hands ultimately.

[Carryon Regardless]

If you want to move then move, you are free to find alternative accom.

I doubt the LL would make any court claim as you say you can prove rents are paid, although I can see a possible wrangle over rents 'due' prior to your move in date if you had already entered into contract ?? Here though the LL is likely to look like a real prat if he tries to claim.

If you prefer to stay,

request a statements of rents, in writing. In fact all your communications should be demonstrable this way. Verbal is toooooo open to mis-interpretation, bad memory, disagreement as to the actual.

List your complaints, reasonably and w/o the emotion you are 'understandably' demonstrating.

If you only require revenge naff off elsewhere it won't help, these things just develop into much worse.

After giving good opportunity for the LL to carry out the actions 'as are reasonable' and here it may be that your demands aren't reasonable as is often with T's, you could use the rents to pay for the works. You don't need to be out of pocket if you manage intelligently.

Most of us here will see that this is a house that is very nearly finished, some concentrated effort and it soon would be.

For example, a few 3.5mm screws and switches aren't hanging, left over building materials can be organised to elsewhere, a few cable ties and earth bond cables aren't strewn loose......

Your LL needs provide a valid 'Gas Safe' certificate, but for your concerns he need not provide any electrical cert. The Council are another matter.

If you employ an IEE registered electrician he would know the requirements and deal with them.

Any respectable contractor would deal with these works with ease, in fact a good handyman could handle it.

Of course the LL could evict you, but if you have only spent the rents what have you lost ?

Then if you have caused the job to be finished and are then paying rents again what advantage to the LL to replace you ?

Is the house when finished going to be a good place to live ?

There is some real crap out there.