section 8 PCOL

[topshelf]

I made a previous post about my tenants not paying any rent its  3 months now, I have issued a section 8 and 21 at the same time, I belivie I can apply for a court hearing tomorrow 22/3/16 I shall do this on line. I want to claim rent arrears as well, ( I know I wont get them, but would like a CCJ ) when I went on to the on line system PCOL it just brings one claim form up  is this the correct one to use, I was looking for N5 and N119   forms ?

Questions,

1) My tenant has her son ( over 18) and partner living with her, they are not on the tenancy agreement, ( yes stupid I have learnt) I never gave them permission to live there, just asked to be notified of any adults living in the house. So can I request they leave before I wait for the section 8 and 21  to take effect  ? can I claim they are squatting and proceed that way ?   

2) If a person receives housing benefit and does not pass any of this on to the landlord, is this not a act of fraud ? the person is claiming expenses for housing and not paying the money for what it was given to them for by the government !   

[Grampa]

You would normally do the application in the names of the tenants on the tenancy agreement. Then if the occupants dont all move out after the possession date the bailiff will remove all occupiers. If you have taken rent payments from those not named that could imply they have a tenancy in their own right which complicates things and it would be best to get professional advise.

If you have tenant who gets HB and is more than 2 months in arrears write to the benefits department with a rent schedule clearly showing the 2 months arrears and request all further payments are made to you the landlord under regulation 95. They have to pay you.

[topshelf]

Thanks Grampa, There is only her name on the tenancy agreement and payments from her, was just looking for another angle to solve this problem. Already been onto the council and submitted that form, still want her out, as her payments will not cover all the rent. Although she was not on benefits when she started the tenancy, I will never again take a tenant on benefits, and the councils wonder why!

Question 2 I have found the answer to this,

Further question, as this is my first year, and yet to go to  the accountant. Can I claim against my tax bill the unpaid rent that I have not received ? I think the answer will be no, but is this something that all landlords should be pushing for and this may make the government give us more representation when chasing unpaid rent. Just a thought.

[Mortitia]

I would just stick with Section 21 unless you know that there is no disrepair at the property.  This is the main failure of S8 cases.  Since so much rent is owed it is unlikely they will pay it all of before hearing date - another favourite of tenants faced with eviction.

The forms you need are on the HMCS website.  N5b is for a hearing after your Section 21 notice expires.  You will also have to attend a hearing for the Section 8 - you can't do it all online.

[topshelf]

Thanks motitia, will carry on with the section 8 as far as I am aware there is no defects in the house, there have none been reported in letter, text,  E mail, or by phone. and has I have not been able to get in the property for a few months its hard to fore see the repairs, I have started writing my requests to visit the property and inspect it in letter form now with proof of posting. yes I know getting the rent may be a nil result, but its the ccj I want, and hopefully  this may save another landlord from her experience.  

[Carryon Regardless]

Be careful using the S8, there's too much wriggle room with them. A claim of disrepair may well gain an adjournment for reports.

Wait till you have possession and issue a credit for the unpaid rents, show that on your accounts and it isn't then seen as revenue for taxation. You simply post it to the last known address (if you feel you must, noone would be any the wiser anyway). 

 

[topshelf]

Yes understand the disrepair area, what I plan to do is, I agreed to meet her at the house last Monday 10am for her to hand over the keys (text message to support) a

excuse was sent on Sunday, I then sent a  text to say that I would still attend, to accept the keys or post some more documents there was no answer . I have posted another letter informing them I wish to inspect the house this Thursday at 11.45 , I am expecting a nil response, I am now going to send a letter every week requesting that they contact me with time and dates suitable for me to make a inspection. I am hoping if they pull the disrepair card I can prove that I have made every effort to attend and inspect the house . I think that sounds reasonable. 

 

[Carryon Regardless]

A judge 'may' think differently.

Not totally correct in law but we are supposed to be able to access for inspection with 24 hours notice. You can always apply some gentle persuarsion that way.

What I do more often is to write to infrom that works will start on ........., and continue until works are complete. They can always request what the works are and then you can decide what sounds right. Just be careful not to deprive them of services, so decorating is reasonable.

Access can be denied, but then you might choose to attend when no one is at home.

Keep batting the ball into their court, most are too lazy to bat it back.

[Mortitia]

I'd go for the S21 or better still 'deed of surrender'.

[topshelf]

Thanks gang, job done they have left, just not sure if its worth the hassle of trying for the rent  arrears, I know I wont get any money out of them but it will be worth the ccj . If I don't know there current address what would I fill in  for there address ? they are not going to give  it to me as I may then call round to collect my fridge, freezer and washing machine that seams to have vanished. Thanks 

[Liz14]

If a tenant removes a landlord's possessions, in this case fridge freezer and washing machine why cannot the police arrest them for theft.  It also amazes me that a tenant can  trash a property (smash bathroom and kitchen fittings etc) and the police cannot arrest them for criminal damage.  

[Melboy]

1 hour ago, Liz14 said:

If a tenant removes a landlord's possessions, in this case fridge freezer and washing machine why cannot the police arrest them for theft.  It also amazes me that a tenant can  trash a property (smash bathroom and kitchen fittings etc) and the police cannot arrest them for criminal damage.  

The police will tell you it is a civil matter. You can press them to take action but it is rarely successful even if you manage to get the matter to a Court hearing.

[Carryon Regardless]

In theory theft and criminal damage by T's is actionable. Proof is the first hurdle, getting the Police to take interest is another.

I reported a departed T who was witnessed by 2 other T's ripping out the co-ax from ground to antenna and off he went with it. There was other damage, abuse blah de blah.

He told the Police it was an accident, end of.

[topshelf]

Now receiving all the unpaid bills/ demands, and the letter from the utilities company notifying my that a warrant has been issued to enter the house to change the meters to pay as you go ones, this was the final straw, so I have reported the missing items to the police, no problem in reporting them at all, gave the product names and serial numbers, I know it wont be a priority, but only a matter of time before a PNC check will be done, as the police had visited the house late last year and left a calling card.