laverda Posted November 9, 2007 Report Share Posted November 9, 2007 I have been informed that my local council will be changing the way housing benifit is paid .They say that from april 2008 all housing benifit payments will be paid direct to claimant and not to landlord. The landlord then has to colect payment from the tenant. I can see this is going to lead to non payment and rent arrears from some housing benifit tenants. some of these tenants will be tempted to spend there housing benifit payments on other things will get into arears and finaly evicted leaving the landlord out of pocket with little chance of recovering rent .In my area there is a shortage of landlords that will accept H.B. tenants . This new payment method will make even more landlords refuse to accept them. I know I wont be taking any on under these rules. I cant see the sense in this as there will be more people on housing benifit that cannot find accomodation. why are they doing this ?. what are your thoughts on this and is this hapening nationwide or just individual councils I would be interested to hear veiws on this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lauralivesartnouveau Posted November 10, 2007 Report Share Posted November 10, 2007 Hi I have been under this system for 2 years as my local council Blackpool was part of the pilot project. In some ways it is an improvement on the old system. The tenant receives the rent every two weeks in arrears rather than every four and it is paid direct to their bank account. It cuts out the landlord chasing the council for the rent as the claim is with the tenant. I also work with the old system in Fylde council and I have more rent arrears problems with them. I was dead against it and made my voice heard at all of the landlord meetings prior to its introduction. However it is easier to manage because you simply ask the tenant to pay if not you evict. Blackpool council was an initial pathfinder for new rules and they have developed some adaptations which will hopefully be rolled out when national changes become live. The main adaptations was 1. LHA (Local Housing Allowance) transparent banding, ie, each tenant category has a rent allowance regardless of rent. Eg currently single over 25 year olds get £87pw etc. This information is available on website http://www.blackpool.gov.uk/services/g-l/h...claims/home.htm 2. They also have a two week rule, in that instead of benefits being paid 4wkly in arrears to landlord they are paid two weekly in arrears to the tenant. This is good news, because I never now lose more than 2 wks rent. 3. Also they send the first payment by cheque to the tenant with the landlords name as the receiver. When you get this you know that their claim is live and you should continue to receive payments direct from the tenant. 4. I get sent tenant payment schedules every two weeks detailing how much each tenant received and the day they received it. This is vital in chasing the rent payments. 5. They also very quickly respond to landlord complaints of lack of rent payments. They are happy to suspend payments to tenants within a couple of weeks and request the tenant to supply proof of payment prior to its reinstatement. I am surprised to say it but after being under the scheme for the last two years I cant wait for it to go live with my other local councils. One big additional benefit is LHA goes to tenant I no longer get overpayment recoveries. I will keep you posted Oliver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trenners Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 Hi, I totally agree with all of Oliver's comments. LHA goes live after 6th April 2008 and applies to all NEW claims after that date. If an existing tenant moves then they will switch to LHA when they move. This is a nationwide initiative. Tenants deemed "vulnerable" can opt to have their benefit paid directly to the landlord but the vast majority will not be deemed vulnerable. In my opinion, Landlords need to "get over themselves". I hear so much negative sentiment from landlords about how the tenant is not going to pay the rent (to the landlord) if the Council pay it directly to the tenant first. This is totally unfounded and, as oliver says, the pilot schemes of the LHA shows that a tenant is no more unlikely to pay their rent to their landlord - whether the money is sent to the tenant or the landlord. What is really ironic is that landlords who have tenants that WORK are paid from the tenant's wages that are paid directly to the tenant . So why don't landlords ask their working tenants to get their employers to pay the rent directly to them from the wages in case they spend their wages before paying the rent. Answer: Lots of landlords discriminate against people who receive benefits (even though most landlords receive benefits themselves in the form of child benefit and child tax credits). Novice (or are they bigoted) landlords claim that these HB tenants will spend their rent money rather than hand it over to their landlord - but I have over 70 HB tenancies running and I can honestly say that this is not the case AT ALL. My HB tenants are honest, straight-forward, people who simply want to live, in peace, and raise their families. LHA ..... bring it on .... it might mean that lots of unethical greedy landlords stop renting out their properties ...... and that can only be good for the business !! Yes - I am pretty passionate about this ! Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lauralivesartnouveau Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 Hi Mark I would just like to add When the benefit tenant returns to work they have gained the habit of rent payment which can only be a good thing. Oliver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Dewsberry Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 No problems with this at all; in fact seems like a very positive and sensible step forward especially sending statements and stopping HB immediately if T reneges on rent ...and loss limited to 2 weeks (which will also stop irresponsible T from getting into a pickle with finance) Very Nanny state but very warrranted as HB would appear to be about to finally take proper control of its logistics..good for everyone ...LL &T Only real issue i have with HB T isnot actually the T BUT HB itself ...as they "loose" so many "forms" and stop HB for no apparent reason to "investigate" and this causes chaos with cash flow for months on end ... Oliver has the new system improved this side of things ?? Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lauralivesartnouveau Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 Hi Simon When it was first introduced 2 years ago they geared right up and got the processing time down to 5 days!!! However since Jan this year they introduced the new computer sys and have been 8 weeks behind ever since. It’s a shame because they did have it sussed Oliver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPEEDTWIN Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 I think its a good idea too. But will the council still make payment to L/L agent if 2 months in arrears???? Also I agree will rodent about the council losing forms, saying one thing then doing another and generally not knowing their arse from their elbow. I phone the benifit office sometimes over a querrie and end up telling them what the rules are cos the guys the other end sometimes are not fully trained. I have at the moment a property we took over (on HB) that was about £1800 in arrears, I sorted a payment plan for the ttenants which they were happy with, the HB came to us and the debt coming down nicely. This week they have a visit from the HB office the official tells them they shouldnt be paying so much and virtually says we are pocketing the cash. To be honest they dont seem to be clever enough to work it out for themselves though they have been given all records of cash in and out of their account. I'm sure they now dont beleive us and beleive the council which means they will proberly tell people locally we are ripping them off which doesnt do us any good. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lauralivesartnouveau Posted November 11, 2007 Report Share Posted November 11, 2007 Hi Yep they still retain the mandatory payment to LL if 8 weeks in arrears but this should not happen as they pay 2weekly. If after two weeks the tenant has not paid if I contact the council they suspend future payments and ask the tenant for proof of rent payment. After investigation they try again to send a chq to tenant in landlords name to get back to sys. They appear to have a policy if the payment exceeds a certain amount I think about £300 they put landlord name on chq. After first payment they send direct transfer to tenant bank account. Most of these tenants have simply set up standing orders to me which is great esp with online banking. Oliver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smarter_Housing Posted November 12, 2007 Report Share Posted November 12, 2007 There's a great article on this in the Autumn issue of Landlord Magazine. You can subscribe for free here. I hope this is of some use Adam Smarter Housing Raising The Standard Fully managed student accommodation, nationwide Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J4L Posted November 13, 2007 Report Share Posted November 13, 2007 I'm still amazed how many local LL's don't even know that they are liable for overpayments, and are unaware of the new rules starting in April. I totally agree with Mark and Oliver here. The idea is to give T's some responsibility with rental payments instead of just thinking they've got to find the shortfall. Plus as mentioned if/when a T starts to earn more money their outgoings don't 'appear' to jump from say £25-£50/ mth to the full rental amount. It gives people no incentive to go and find a job by missing them out on the payment side of things so I welcome this scheme with open arms. I wish I could say this for some of the LL's who I've mentioned this to because some are living in the dark ages, thinking it's 'guaranteed income' and who are not aware of their responsibility of overpayments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lauralivesartnouveau Posted November 13, 2007 Report Share Posted November 13, 2007 Hi On overpayments issue I note that rules changed last year and Tenant is responsible for overpayments in respect of any change in circumstances such as income. Landlord only liable for overpayment which has occurred after tenant vacated property or changed primary address. This is only a problem when tenant goes AWOL and the first you know is when you get an overpayment schedule and council tax bill for a tenant who left a month ago without letting you know. This has happened to me several times this year but not in Blackpool where they get LHA instead of HB. Oliver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lauralivesartnouveau Posted November 26, 2007 Report Share Posted November 26, 2007 Hi I would just like to add re LHA pilot Blackpool Council set up a rent bond scheme for vulnerable groups. They underwrite the bond for damage so no need for TDS They then pay the landlord rent direct as though previous HB. Oliver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPEEDTWIN Posted November 27, 2007 Report Share Posted November 27, 2007 Hi I note that rules changed last year and Tenant is responsible for overpayments in respect of any change in circumstances such as income. Landlord only liable for overpayment which has occurred after tenant vacated property or changed primary address. This is only a problem when tenant goes AWOL and the first you know is when you get an overpayment schedule and council tax bill for a tenant who left a month ago without letting you know. Oliver what happens if the tenant dies and there is a overpayment due to change of income (extra overtime) can they still chase L/L or L/A. do you know the regulation number for the rule change many thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lauralivesartnouveau Posted November 27, 2007 Report Share Posted November 27, 2007 Hi I have experienced a death with a tenant on HB. They closed the claim on the day the tenant died and treated it as a change of address and claimed back an overpayment from me. This was difficult to explain to her relatives who asked me if they could have a couple of months to address her affairs. Out of courtesy I let them have a couple of weeks while I concentrated on another property. They were disgusted with the council but declined my offer to let them pay the rent. In the end they made the effort to remove the effects within a couple of weeks as agreed. Oliver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lauralivesartnouveau Posted November 27, 2007 Report Share Posted November 27, 2007 Hi Regarding regulation for overpayments I got really hung up over this last Christmas as on the Friday before the holiday my post arrived at 2pm with a letter from the council which closed an hour earlier for two weeks at 1pm. The letter stated that one of my HB tenants was not entitled to the last two years rent and they were making arrangements to recover over £10,000 from me as I had received the benefit. This put a damper over the holiday season and I could not do any thing (except research) until the Council Reopened on the 5th Jan. My research paid off I read every HB circular for the last two years on the DWP web site and found the following HB/CTB A13/2006 and HB/CTB A4/2006 both of which discussed the regulation changes effective from April 2006 in relation to the recovery of overpayments. On paragraph 13 of HB/CTB A4/2006 regulation 6(3) to (5) it discussed at great length the change that apart from change of address all recoveries of overpayments will be the tenants responsibility. In my desperation I formulated a report full of useful quotations in order to argue my point that I should not have to repay the two years HB. I waited for the council to open at 9am (with tenant in toe) and demanded a private interview room in order to make my presentation. A guy came and looked at the letter and logged on to the system shook his head said sorry it was a computer error. He appeared very surprised when I quoted the circulars which I don’t think he understood or had even read. My Christmas ruined over someone pressing the wrong button hope this year proves uneventful. Oliver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lauralivesartnouveau Posted November 29, 2007 Report Share Posted November 29, 2007 Hi One of my tenants discovered a loophole in the LHA system. They moved in to property and set up their LHA claim. Once it was all set up with live direct bank payments they moved (to me). She then fraudulently set up a new claim in a new name at the new address and received a second set of payments. My point is that once payments are live because they are paid by bank credit rather than by cheque the risk of this type of fraud increases. Oliver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Dewsberry Posted November 29, 2007 Report Share Posted November 29, 2007 Surely HB/LHA can use and link up with unique NI no's or is that too much to ask from local government ??!!!! Would sort out a lot of fiddling when they finally get round to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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