Pauly Posted December 10, 2007 Report Share Posted December 10, 2007 Hi folks, I have recently served notice on a troublesome dss tenant. He signed a ast and the rent agreed on the ast is £725pcm which started on 13th May 2006. When the claim finally started the tenant owed 2 months rent which I had to get from the guarantor. The third months rent was paid into my bank, but was £670 instead of £725, I asked the tenant what was going on, he said that the council is paying every 28 days, but over the year there would be 13 payments of £670 which would cover the full yearly amount owed. I reluctantly agreed. However, he is due to sling his hook on 3rd Feb. Consequently, I will be out of pocket, do you think I should withhold the total rent that I should have been paid, it's approx two/three hundred quid. The tenant had changed lots of things without permission and has only paid the rent once on time. There's a side alley next to the property, and I've got a feeling that when he moves out he will try and dump loads of rubbish, therefore I recently took a 'dated' digital photo of the alley and intend to hold back a further £120 for a skip if he does dump his rubbish. Also the carpets (which were brand new) are filthy, I don't think they can be cleaned even by a specialised cleaning company, these cost me £400. The Exposed fireplace, has been painted (without permission) and drilled into to put tatty shelves up, I'm planning of getting quotes to remove the paint and fit new bricks that were damaged. He also fit dimmer switches without permission and without using a qualified electrician. I've always fixed any problems that have needed to be done promptly, but from the start this tenant has been very manipulative and is sneaky and knows all the tricks in the book to make situations work in his favour, and even called out the fire brigade to fit a new smoke alarm because he wouldn't pay £1 for a new battery!! I'm quite angry, and don't want to give back the tenant any more deposit than he deserves, I've already had a couple of face-to-face confrontations and fear one more might push me over the edge. Your advise is welcome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pugsy Posted December 10, 2007 Report Share Posted December 10, 2007 Keep away and instead source a good handyman and get him to visit the property and give you a quote (inc. dodgy electrics). If this seems reasonable, get it in writing and this would be deducted, you cannot better your property out of the tenants deposit but you are allowed by law to get it back to the way it was when you let it out (fair wear and tear allowed). Further the rubbish isn't really an issue is it, because you are not handing over the remains of the deposit until after he has left, by which time you will have inspected to see if this has been dumped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GPEL Posted December 10, 2007 Report Share Posted December 10, 2007 React to what you know, not what you think might happen. After the property has been returned deal with correcting property problems and use remainder of the deposit, if any, to offset rent arrears for expected income during period of the tenancy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPEEDTWIN Posted December 10, 2007 Report Share Posted December 10, 2007 I would pay for any rent arrears out of his deposit but make it clear to him if you receive any more cash from the council (and you most likely will unless it is stopped) you will pass it onto him. He will be able check if further payments come to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Dewsberry Posted December 11, 2007 Report Share Posted December 11, 2007 you are right to be cautious .....but cannot start applying costs until you know what they are going to be!!!!! Wait until "he/she" have gone AND then you may apply costs! S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pauly Posted December 11, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 11, 2007 Thanks for your opinion guys. What about the carpets though? They cost me £400 and were brand new, they are now badly soiled, do you think I should deduct £400 from the deposit. A cleaning company would probably charge less than £100 but in my opinion it's likely that they are beyond cleaning, it's harden, filthy grime. Regarding the painting of and drilling into the exposed fireplace, I will get a quote from a decorator and deduct this from the deposit. Would you guys think I have a legitimate right to deduct the cost of a qualified electrician to change the dodgy dimmer switches back, or indeed get a new electrical safety test done and deduct this from the deposit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Posted December 11, 2007 Report Share Posted December 11, 2007 I'm sure the depreciation for wear & tear is about 20% per year straight line on carpets, if they need replacing then I think you would be well within your right to charge at least £240 for this (60% of the cost), more if you want to be pedantic that he has only been there 1 year and about 7 months. I would have to agree with you on the electrician. If he can't prove a qualified electrician did the job in writing from the electrician himself then it would be irresonsible not to have the test done/or electrician inspect the work/confirm safe. All chargeable to the tenant - he broke the AST by doing this work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GPEL Posted December 11, 2007 Report Share Posted December 11, 2007 It's suprising how a proper carpet clean can restore some seemingly hopeless cases. You have an obligation to limit your tenant's costs whether you like it or not. I would get them prof. cleaned and then make a judgement as to serviceability and diminuition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pugsy Posted December 11, 2007 Report Share Posted December 11, 2007 Isn't amazing how often we talk about carpets! Get a proper carpet cleaner in for a quote, then you'll know if they are beyond or not. The sad truth is that carpets are only new once, and even with fair wear and tear, your next tenant will dirty them, you may as well get used to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Posted December 11, 2007 Report Share Posted December 11, 2007 What if you pay £100 to clean carpet to find it still looks s**t? I guess you then charge £340 to the tenant. I just can't see the tenant being that happy with that even though you tried the cheapest option, but it didn't work out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GPEL Posted December 11, 2007 Report Share Posted December 11, 2007 That's why if there's any doubt you get the opinion of a prof. carpet cleaner before deciding on the way ahead and put it to the tenant before proceeding. Even if it does look bad afterwards it's no justification to cost the replacement from the deposit if carpet's are still serviceable, you deduct for loss of value as the carpets are now clean but stained. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pauly Posted December 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted December 12, 2007 Thanks guys, your comments have been very helpful. I have just received this months' rent payment from the guarantor (as the tenant didn't pay me and switched off his mobile for days on end). The tenant is paying one months in advance and has now told the guarantor that he doesn't have to pay the last months rent because he has paid me a deposit of one month. I have told the guarantor that the last months rent needs to be paid in advance, and if it's not and there are repair cost I will pass this debt on to a debt recovery company. It sounds abit agressive but this tenant has constantly tested my resolve and has tried to run rings around me. My advice to landlords is NO DSS, it may sound discriminatory, this is the first and last time i've taken on a dss tenant. A friend of mine who is also a landlord recieved absolutley no rent in six months, only the threat of a debt recovery company made the guarantor pay up! I try and treat people how I want to be treated myself, mabe before I was abit naive but now I know I will toughen up, still try to be fair, but next time lay down the law more and at the first sign of crap serve notice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selkirk Posted December 12, 2007 Report Share Posted December 12, 2007 Pauly I'm with you, the biggest pain I ever had was a DSS and it cost me £2.5k in the end. I can't even say that it was all the T's fault either, never again I'm afraid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GPEL Posted December 12, 2007 Report Share Posted December 12, 2007 It's an industry fact that some categories of tenants are potentially more troublesome than others.EG DSS applicants, young adults etc. Unfortunately, the bad tenants blight it for others that might also fall in this bracket and are trustworthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simhar Posted December 16, 2007 Report Share Posted December 16, 2007 Theres always 1 bad apple that spoils it for the rest ! cheers simhar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Dewsberry Posted December 16, 2007 Report Share Posted December 16, 2007 Theres always 1 bad apple that spoils it for the rest ! cheers simhar ????????????????????????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julierob Posted January 3, 2008 Report Share Posted January 3, 2008 Unfortunately there seem to be more and more bad apples around. We have just had a tenant leave us without paying the last month rent (part of which was paid to her by the DSS). She informed us we could keep the bond, which would have been fine if she had left the place as she had found it. Apart from the normal wear and tear and damage she caused when actually moving out chipping paintwork etc., she hadn't cleaned the fridge or put a cloth over the kitchen tops. She just couldn't care less. So we are out of pocket as the bond is going to pay the rent and we are left with nothing for helping rectify the property to its orignial state. I am sick of the fact that the law is so heavily stacked in the tenant's favour. They can do what the hell they like to your property, leave you with months of rent unpaid and really there is not a thing you can do. The DSS don't care what they spend their housing benefit on, be it cigarettes, drink or whatever. They pay out millions for the purpose of paying a tenant's rent but in many cases that is not where the money ends up. It is ridiculous and there should be different legislation brought in - guess what, there is, but it is going to help the fraudulent tenants even more, as from April new rules are being brought into effect that the DSS never pay the rent direct to the Landlord. As the OP said, we treat people as we expect to be treated ourselves and I know our ex tenant is a landlord herself, so I hope that her tenants do the same to her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GPEL Posted January 3, 2008 Report Share Posted January 3, 2008 When taking a DSS tenant always ensure they have a fully referenced guarantor with income of at least 3 times annual rent, then go after them if no joy with the tenant. They are likely to be more responsible and concerned about CCJs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julierob Posted January 3, 2008 Report Share Posted January 3, 2008 When taking a DSS tenant always ensure they have a fully referenced guarantor with income of at least 3 times annual rent, then go after them if no joy with the tenant. They are likely to be more responsible and concerned about CCJs. When she took the tenancy she wasn't DSS she had a full time job. Then she got pregnant (or may have been pregnant when she commenced tenancy) and gave up her job. Should we then have asked her for a guarantor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Dewsberry Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 When she took the tenancy she wasn't DSS she had a full time job. Then she got pregnant (or may have been pregnant when she commenced tenancy) and gave up her job. Should we then have asked her for a guarantor? Tricky one and hard to enforce ...have been in this sit a few times (T leaving and using bond to cover last mth rent ) To counter act it ..take 1.5 x month rent min then at least you have a couple of hundred in the kitty to cover cleaning damages etc...also take a set up fee ( and include a couple of quid for cleaning ...i charge £100 set up ..£25 ref £30 TDS and £45 in the kitty) Then when the T does this also put a DC (ao at least the threat of one ) on to the T and they usually cough up .......Rent is rent Bond id Bond ...as soon as it i late apply a £5 per day late pymnt fee (needs to be in your ast ) also £15-£20 for each weekly reminder letter PLUS interest ...also inform them that DC will charge 15% of tot as collection fee and they (the T) will be paying NOT you .... If you do all the above you have covered all bases and will find most T WILL pay last mths rent as it is far too expensive not to !!!!! Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GPEL Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 When she took the tenancy she wasn't DSS she had a full time job. Then she got pregnant (or may have been pregnant when she commenced tenancy) and gave up her job. Should we then have asked her for a guarantor? I see, tricky one due to change of circumstances. I'd possibly have advised her that at the end of the fixed period you'd only allow continued occupancy with a guarantor but this happened mid-term so it's a case of biting the bullet and taking measures such as those already mentioned to minimize losses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julierob Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 Thank you Rodent and GPEL - I will certainly try and take all those precautions next time. Although it seems hard enough to get them to stump up for monies up front like that. On a slightly different note having read through your posts Rodent on this and another landlord site, I will certainly be going for the option of insurance based deposit - and adding the cost of the insurance on to the set up charges. It seems too risky to put the deposit in the hands of the other schemes. Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Dewsberry Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 Hi Julie Just wait until July when all the students leave, then the Sxxx will hit the fan ! Which bit of the vale are you in ? no where near my best mate J4L i suppose ??!! Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julierob Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 Hi Simon I live in Penarth but the properties are in Barry. Do you mean that when the students leave there will be a surplus of properties to rent? Sorry but I am a bit on the naive side on these forums. Thanks Julie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Dewsberry Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 No what i meant was that this will be the first "big wave" of people comming out of ast's ...and suspect there will be a few "disputes" with deposits ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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