Grampa Posted April 11, 2015 Report Share Posted April 11, 2015 If they return the deposit they still can serve a s21. Even though the landlord is a company it still has to supply a address to you and be able to prove it if necessary, so as I mentioned earlier no rent is legally payable (if you choose to) until they provide that address. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karenrobinson Posted April 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 14, 2015 Hi all, the landlord has been in touch and is offering them 2 weeks rent free (if they pay the arrears of £175 which is equivalent to 2 weeks rent!!!) and has told them he is serving them 2 months notice which he will send in writing. Today he has text to ask when it is convenient to have a gas check as he ''thinks it is quite important''. He claims to have been in touch with his solicitor who has advised him to return their bond in cash immediately. He has also said that he is advertising the flat with an estate agent and can they tell him when they are leaving. Obviously they haven't found anywhere yet as it's only been a few days. How should we proceed. I have advised that she make an appt with the council again when she receives the letter from his solicitor and to go from there. I'm assuming if he hands the bond back and organises the gas check they will have no legal right to stay and he can S21 them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karenrobinson Posted April 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 14, 2015 Plus, her orginal claim for housing support has now expired as he failed to supply the address so they wont even have the rent money when it is due on 22nd April. They have applied again but they now owe over a thousand pound to her dad (who they borrowed the rent money from). Do they have a claim against the landlord regarding this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grampa Posted April 14, 2015 Report Share Posted April 14, 2015 As stated previously if the address isn't provided no rent is legally due.Also no tenant has to vacate without a court order from the court.So they serve a s21 which gives 2 months notice. If the tenant still doesn't leave the landlord has to apply for a court order which will take a minimum of 5-6 weeks before it go in front of a judge. The judge will then give another 14 days and if the tenant still doesn't move out the landlord has to apply for a court bailiff which will be at least another 2 weeks but could be 5-7 weeks depending on how buzy they are in your area.You will/should get a copy of all paperwork from the courts at each stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fionaf Posted April 14, 2015 Report Share Posted April 14, 2015 Consider carefully going all the way to the bailiff. I know a council will nearly always advise a tenant to stay put as long as possible and will try and say if they move out too early they are making themselves wilfully homeless so go to the bottom of the queue. However you have to weigh this up with the prospect of having a CCJ against your name. As a landlord who's seen two tenants go to the wire until the bailiff calls it is distressful on all sides but the reason it usually goes that far is as both sides have no choice, one will not be supported by the council if they comply with the s.21 notice and the other will have their livelihood ruined if they continue without rent for months on end. I did however see somewhere that councils were proven to be stretching the 'wilfully homeless' argument re staying on as long as possible after a s.21 is served, but most still seem to continue with the practice. The tenant is also liable for the court fees and potentially enormous legal advice fees if their tenancy agreement has been properly worded by their landlord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grampa Posted April 14, 2015 Report Share Posted April 14, 2015 If the landlord evicts via s21 the ccj shouldn't be any more than £280 which is the court application fee paid for by the landlord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karenrobinson Posted May 29, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 29, 2015 Hi there, well it's still ongoing. Eventually the new landlord had his solicitor write with the correct address so the housing claim could go through. However, this has left a deficit in rent arrears which my son cannot raise due to being out of work. We eventually had the gas check done, and the bond was returned (it was def not in a scheme) 2 weeks ago so I am aware they can now serve sec 21. The solicitor is now vying for the arrears, but housing will not backdate their initial claim as too much time has passed. The solicitor is now attempting to make good the Guarantor from the original landlord and original tenancy agreement. Can he do this. Can the gurantor be carried over to a new owner? There is still no new tenancy agreement as the kids have found a new property to move into, but that wont be for another month or so. Our contact at housing has stated we can still make a civil claim re the bond even tho it has now been returned. Is this correct? Facts recap - January, the kids applied for housing. The kids borrowed from family to pay Jan, Feb and half March rent. Only when they stopped paying rent did the Landlord have his solicitor give address notice. Housing closed their January claim due to being out of time. Kids reapplied in April and it was granted from May (that's how long it took for landlord to give the information) First housing payment is June 4th BUT only for 4 weeks in arrears - ie month of May. Solicitor seeking rent for half march and April and May. Kids have no way of paying this as on Jobseekers. Any advice? Many thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grampa Posted May 29, 2015 Report Share Posted May 29, 2015 If the landlords solicitor tries to chase the arrears via the small claims court you can counter claim for 3 x the deposit value for the breach of non protection of the deposit. You could also try the argument that the guarantee was between the previous landlord and you and not the new landlord but I'm not sure if that would work or not I guess it would be down to the judge on the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karenrobinson Posted May 29, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 29, 2015 Thank you Grampa, Even though the bond was returned last week? The kids paid 875 for jan feb and half march (which they now owe family), the solicitor is chasing 875 for half march, april & may. I have advised the solicitor that our counterclaim will be 875 lost in housing from his lack of cooperation in Jan Feb Half march + the civil case re the bond + lost housing for april. I had hoped (if my train of thought is correct) that the solicitor would advise the landlord to cut his losses and be thankful the kids don't sue for the bond (which will put the landlord out of pocket). I have no intention of 'screwing' said landlord, I just want what is fair. Karenx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karenrobinson Posted May 29, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 29, 2015 PS. The solicitor is claiming we cannot sue over the bond as it has been returned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grampa Posted May 29, 2015 Report Share Posted May 29, 2015 The solicitor is 100% incorrect on that point and you might suggest he reads up on his housing law or point you to which act of parliament states you cannot make a claim. I would be very interested in his reply and watch him wriggle. If a landlord returns the deposit in full, the tenant can still claim the (up to) three times penalty because “the initial requirements of a scheme” were not complied with. There is a 6 year limitation for a tenant (or ex-tenant) to make a claim. section 214 Housing Act 2004 provides that where the court is satisfied that the deposit was not protected within 30 days (or prescribed information not given in that time-scale), the court must order the payment of between 1 and 3 times the deposit- (4) The court must order the landlord to pay to the applicant a sum of money not less than the amount of the deposit and not more than three times the amount of the deposit within the period of 14 days beginning with the date of the making of the order. http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2004/34/section/214 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grampa Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 PS. The solicitor is claiming we cannot sue over the bond as it has been returned. Another prime example of mickey mouse solicitors playing at housing law when they don't have enough housing conveyancing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carryon Regardless Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 Sorry don't have time to read all. Did the G'tor sign a 'Deed of Guarantee'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karenrobinson Posted May 30, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 Thank you so much guys. Your help is astounding. The document says Guarantor Agreement. The Landlord's name on the document is the original owner of the property (who sold to current Landlord) and it is witnessed and signed by the estate agent who was acting for the original Landlord. Current Landlord did not use the estate agent and has been receiving the rent directly into his account with no 3rd party involvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grampa Posted May 30, 2015 Report Share Posted May 30, 2015 Though it was witnessed does the paperwork say anywhere it is a "deed" or is the word "deed" mentioned anywhere? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karenrobinson Posted May 31, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 31, 2015 Hi Grampa, The word deed does not appear anywhere. 'Gurantor agreement' for residential lettings. no deed in any of the text within. signed by guarantor, witnessed by estate agent and (pp'd) signed on behalf of landlord by estate agent also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grampa Posted May 31, 2015 Report Share Posted May 31, 2015 That doesn't mean its not valid it just means the contract isn't as "heavy weight" as one drawn up as a deed. If a non deed guarantee was signed after the tenancy had started it would be invalid so that is one angle to look at if applicable. Also the devil is in the wording. If you could re-print the guarantor wording here I could give an opinion on it as some are very badly worded and not enforceable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karenrobinson Posted June 1, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2015 Thank you Grandpa, may I email you it? I have it scanned. Don't know how to do that on here but happy to supply you my email for you to reply, so I can send you it. Thank you again x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karenrobinson Posted June 1, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2015 And no, it was drawn and signed the same day as the tenancy began. K x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karenrobinson Posted June 1, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2015 Interesting day, Had a call from wakefield Housing. Seems the landlord's solicitor is making an attempt to have the benefit paid directly to the landlord. Housing were initially going to do it - no questions asked - it has now been suspended until I can explain the situation to them. I find it shocking that they were about to hand over the payments and facilitate a landlord who has broken every law with regards to being a landlord without hearing any defence from the claimant. I refuse to retreat with Mr Asian Landlord and his Asian solicitor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grampa Posted June 1, 2015 Report Share Posted June 1, 2015 Remember under regulation 95 of the housing benefit rules a landlord has right to have any HB payments paid directly to them if there are arrears of more than 2 months. This rule is fairly black or white. But if the arrears were £1 below 2 months arrears they wouldn't be able to do it. Regardless to what rules have been broken the rent should still be paid but there can be compensatory deductions that have to be agreed by both parties or a court. How much those deductions are depends on the loss/restriction and or material loss the tenant is suffering now compared to the original agreement /condition of the property. So as a simple example if you had a 3 bed property that rented out for £1000 pcm but you couldn't use one bedroom due to a leak/water damage (that wasn't repaired in reasonable time) the compensatory value could be the difference between a similar 2 bed property that maybe £900 pcm and therefore the value would/could be £100 pcm. I know other situations or yours are not as simple but you get the idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grampa Posted June 1, 2015 Report Share Posted June 1, 2015 duplicated post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karenrobinson Posted June 1, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2015 I get it darling. I'm just annoyed he breaks the rules and then applies the rules when it suits!!! I've done some research today. The guarantor is definitly not a deed. I have read however, that gurantors become void if there is a change in tenancy, eg rent increase. Since it is a new landlord, will that rule apply? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grampa Posted June 1, 2015 Report Share Posted June 1, 2015 Depends on the wording. Mine continue for every renewal, including periodic and rent increases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karenrobinson Posted June 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 3, 2015 Is that because you have it worded into your agreements? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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