Another saturday, another phone call from our tenants.

[chickpea]

Sorry, Cor, you've lost me.

What do you mean, how can I expect the tenant to repair a problem when I and my professional couldn't identify the cause?

As stated in my post, the plumber went in today and it was visible to all and sundry that the bath plug plunger knob was loose. It didn't take any skill or expertise to see it - in the same way that when the shower head was loose from the hose, that too was obvious to the naked eye.

[chickpea]

Richlist - it wasn't loose when they moved in, it wasn't loose last time the plumber was called out because he would have spotted it straight away (as he did today).

You said in a previous post on a different topic that you had it written into your tenant "welcome" pack that you expected tenants to effect minor repairs - tightening up screws and hardware. Wouldn't you consider this a similar thing?

If they couldn't/wouldn't do it themselves, surely they should have informed us that it was loose so that we could have dealt with it?

I'm trying hard to understand how the tenants can be absolved of all responsibility for what's happened, but I'm struggling.

[Chestnut]

Tracey,

It is easy for you to plead your point with the hindsight of cause and effect.

I'm sorry, but I for one would not expect a tenant, or indeed anyone, to immediately associate a loose bathplug knob with water trickling through a light fitting. There are several sources in a bathroom where water could come from and find its way to ceiling below.

(In my case it was running down behind from top row of wall tiles after new shower was used - it took me several weeks to find this cause - solved by retiling up to ceiling over bath.)

In my opinion it is the landlord's responsibility to provide reliable equipment and take the can whenever it isn't. Why should a tenant expect anything less?

[Antnkel]

I had a tenant phone up stating they could hear a driping under the bath, so they drained the bath and asked me to come round asap.

I came round the next day took the bath panel off and the overflow pipe was split, I replaced the whole assembly.

Wouldn't of expected them to try and find the problem or try and fix.

I don't have an agent looking after it though!!

[Carryon Regardless]

I don't suggest that T's have no responsibility. A problem is discerning a difference between reasonable, moral and legal.

Your T's aren't reasonable, their style is demanding to the point of abuse. They have unrealistic expectations, well in practice maybe not so unrealistic.

What I missed was that you have had different causes for the same or similar effect, so I assumed the cause had been missed previously, sorry.

Now if your descriptions cause a Judge or arbitrator to make the same assumption there would be no apology.

The whole story is somewhat confusing and when the T's voice their defence I would be surprised if they don't get the greater sympathy, not because it's reasonable or morally correct but because that's invariably the easier result.

The power these T's have over you is scary, there is fear here that I could spoil your New Year.

They are in your very valuable property.

They owe you big dosh for future rents, payment of which is totally in their control as you are experiencing.

If they so wish you can not enter the property, forget emergencies they have the control again of your awareness of such.

Things go Tuts Up for the next ???? months you're left with the result and very often with little chance of financial recovery.

You spend more dosh and go through big stress to get the gits out.

When you gave them the keys you gave them the power, now management becomes a delicate matter, more often from the angle of educating. Even mature T's can be big kids yours 'aint they are kids.

If what's right was all that was needed I would have many, many more thousands to enjoy. Instead I have been caused to give to individual charities called T's.

[chickpea]

Chesnut - my description of the problem must be unclear in some way.

It was clearly visible that the overflow had come loose from the overflow pipe HOWEVER the tenant thought it reasonable to then use the overflow as an overflow.

I ask the question again - if the sink was obviously blocked, would it be reasonable for the tenant to continue running water down it?

If the answer is no, how/why do we expect tenants to turn off water at the stopcock when there is a leak? Surely the 2 concepts are the same?

I'm not suggesting the tenant should have known that water coming through the ceiling was from the bath (although it doesn't take a genius to work out that it wasn't a coincidence that it stopped when the taps were stopped and the bath drained) - I AM suggesting that if you have a loose connection with a water pipe, it's not a great idea to continue to run water through it (as illustrated by Mel's post above).

Thanks for all replies.

Clearly, to even expect our tenants to know how to shut their own front door is expecting too much.

[Richlist]

You said in a previous post on a different topic that you had it written into your tenant "welcome" pack that you expected tenants to effect minor repairs - tightening up screws and hardware. Wouldn't you consider this a similar thing?

If they couldn't/wouldn't do it themselves, surely they should have informed us that it was loose so that we could have dealt with it?

I'm trying hard to understand how the tenants can be absolved of all responsibility for what's happened, but I'm struggling.

* I wouldn't expect a tenant to fix a loose or detached bath overflow but I would certainly expect them to inform the landlord immediately it became apparant to them..

* Equally I would expect a landlord to demonstrate the correct use of this type of device to a young inexperienced tenant.

As already posted.......

1. Young tenants have little or no experience of anything outside the norm .

2. If your property contains ANYTHING a little unusual, its correct function should be shown to the tenants.

3. Instruction manuals should always be provided for everything possible.

4. A moving in help sheet should also be provided.

5. Anything likely to cause a problem eg a hand shower should be removed and capped off.