Section 8 Advice, please

[Carryon Regardless]

At 2 of my 5 affectionately named "slum flats" the tenancies have turned hostile, we've discussed these previously.

In May I served S8 and S21's on both, by hand and witnessed.

The S21's notice period expires at the end of July, then of course there is an expected 6 weeks to court date, plus the periods that follow prior to repossession.

The S8's expired on 16th June.

I messed up the S8's in that with one I detailed clause 14 but didn't describe why it's cited, in truth then it was only vaguely applicable.

The other that did have clause 14 applicable I didn't cite it but did describe it. In other words drawing up the notices at the same time I confused the content between the two S8's, only a little but enough for a defence I expect.

Things have definitely turned more hostile since service. Last Monday I was at the flats to carry out works. With my car parked at the rear my egress was blocked by a T's car, intentionally, with music blasting out. Clearly a challenge and with my lack of patience I rose to the challenge. With a refusal to shift the car I shifted it myself. Prior to this and since they are proactive in turning the site into an undesirable location.

So far 3 hour long conversations with the local Police, the last this morning when the WPC rang me. They wish for me to progress repossession as soon as and have offered to write up a report detailing their many attendances and why. They believe any court will listen sympathetically, sounds good to me.

So to the point.

I can reserve the S8's, with all clauses as before but both with 14 for the antisocial behaviour.

I believe I can make the court application immediately following service, due to the nature of clause 14 ??

Will I still be able to get the money order for the unpaid rents etc, as these clauses for unpaid rents etc are usually 2 weeks till notice expiry?

Do I expect the same 6 week lead period till a court date or do courts act more swiftly in such circumstances?

Any other suggestions gratefully appreciated.

Who needs Eastenders when I already have Welshenders?

[Richlist]

I'm in the process of doing my tax returns for 2013/14....I usually complete it quite quickly but I'm a bit later than usual for me this year.

It might seem at first glance that this has very little to do with COR's problems BUT......it never ceases to amaze me how I can so easily forget those little expenses & travel costs which help to reduce my enormous tax bill. I'm sure that all this extra activity, travel, hassle, phone calls & other expense is sometimes overlooked when completing your tax returns COR.....DON'T FORGET, it all helps.

[Carryon Regardless]

My internet and phones are all proportioned.

My mileage is at the 45p per mile and also proportioned, I know this isn't strictly correct as we should itemise each journey but I'll wait for Mr Taxman to pull me up on it, meanwhile those years more than 6 years in history are just that, history.

Of course the £280 x 2 that is unlikely to be recovered is tax allowable, but I will try to recover it hence one of my questions regarding the money order.

Often here, and other places, I read "and the expense is set off against tax" as though the tax man pays for the expense. So many fail to realise that, at best, the taxman can only offset a small portion of the expense, the rest is still out of our pocket.

What I will get nothing back for is the time, effort and stress, bloody useless taxman.

[Grampa]

Cor when you served the s8 using grounds 14 did you include an extract of Housing Act which has grounds 14 shown and an explanation of why each ground is being relied on?

Also you would have needed to include any supporting documentation (e.g. police reports, local authority reports etc.) Though if you didn't I am unsure if you can include these at a later date.

I think you are better off waiting until your s21 can be used. But let me tell you a little tip I have only just found out. As soon as you can act on the s21 don't send the paperwork off to the court as you would normally. Use the on-line possession route you would normally use with a s8. not only is it £250 and not £280 you can add the arrears to the order at the same time and as you are doing it on-line you get a court date a lot quicker.

https://www.possessionclaim.gov.uk/pcol/

You still have to attend court in the same manner as a s8 but provided your s21 is valid you will get possession and if arrears proven an order for that as well.

I learn from a RGI company I have just started using and have a claim going through.

Possession claim on-line can be used for both s21 and s8 but you have to attend the court hearing

[Richlist]

Someone (Grampa ?) could do really well by producing a book giving clear/ concise guidance on these matters. If ever there was a need for a definitive guide.....this is it, in my opinion.

Something along similar lines to Carl Bayleys 'How to Avoid Property Tax' but titled....

'Dealing with Tenants on Benefits....A Landlords Guide'.

Update it annually with changes to the law & claims processes.......then sit back and enjoy the income.

[Grampa]

Any idea the what the profit % the author gets?

Or what about a separate e-books to download at a reasonable (or not so reasonable) cost? Each book could be a separate article on a different stage from starting the tenancy to ending the tenancy and a few extra for eviction and council issues. You set it up RL I will bash up a few short articles.

This time next year we will be millionaires

[Richlist]

Well my understanding is that the author needs to produce a draft in order to get a publisher interested.....same probably applies to ebooks. So, its not a case of setting anything up, writing the draft is the first stage and the one that requires all the technical expertise.

As for being millionaires next year.....I thought, like me, you were already there Grampa ?

[Grampa]

Unfortunately having teenage kids put a stop to that and I'm now on the breadline.

[Richlist]

Oh yes, teenage children, I remember that period of my life. Its probably hard to believe now but like the rest of us you will get thru it and come out stronger the other side.

The time to start worrying about money is when you can't pass the credit checks to rent your own properties.

[Melboy]

I like the idea of a book..... so get typing Grampa.

I have a close friend who is retired and he is a published author on many local items of interest but when I met him last Friday he didn't have the look of being a millionaire.

[Grampa]

A number of my clients are millionaires and it is surprising how "careful" they are with their money. Some I occasionally socialise and eat out with and one will pocket any cheese left on the cheese board to take home.

Another wears the scruffiest clothes and drives the most beaten up old car you have ever seen. These are cash millionaires not just property millionaires.

It brings a smile to my face when I see them trundle past.

Though I cant say I have met RL I have always imagined him to be rather dapper looking.

[Melboy]

Though I cant say I have met RL I have always imagined him to be rather dapper looking.

Do you mean RL is like my Avitar Grampa ?

Going back a few years it was always a surprise to me to see the person in the flesh on the telly after listening to them on the radio.

It never matched up.

[Grampa]

Well if we wanted some light hearted fun maybe we should post some tongue in cheek pictures of what we imagine each other to look like.

[Richlist]

That's my brother & me on the back of our truck in my Avatar.

My brother had this brilliant business idea of setting up a camel transporting business but unfortunately it hasn't quite taken off yet....he's not getting much any work.

So, if you have a camel that needs transporting, I know a man who can help.

[Melboy]

I wouldn't have thought there was much of a call for camel transportation in Essex......... but there again............

[Grampa]

He must be getting the hump due to the lack of demand.

[Richlist]

I wouldn't have thought there was much of a call for camel transportation in Essex.

Well, that just goes to show how much you know......Essex has the highest camel population in the UK, as shown in last months publication of 'Camel Monthly'.

Still, if only he had spoken to you first perhaps he might have made a better informed business decision.

[Melboy]

I wouldn't have thought there was much of a call for camel transportation in Essex.

Well, that just goes to show how much you know......Essex has the highest camel population in the UK, as shown in last months publication of 'Camel Monthly'.

Still, if only he had spoken to you first perhaps he might have made a better informed business decision.

Well there you go. You learn something new every day.

I know train fares into London are now very expensive so perhaps a Camel train is the answer.

I spent a lot of time in the Middle East in past years so my knowledge of Camels is......well.....zero.

Oh! and they stink to high heaven.

[Richlist]

That's not fair........its not their fault, you'd stink if you didn't wash.

Camels are one of the most intelligent animals around. they just don't have regular access to suitable washing facilities......especially in the Middle East. Perhaps you noticed whilst you were there that there is a distinct lack of rivers & lakes in which to bathe ones camel ?

[Melboy]

That's not fair........its not their fault, you'd stink if you didn't wash.

Camels are one of the most intelligent animals around. they just don't have regular access to suitable washing facilities......especially in the Middle East. Perhaps you noticed whilst you were there that there is a distinct lack of rivers & lakes in which to bathe ones camel ?

The Camels were always washed off in the sea as I recall along with their handlers.

I never could understand why a brand of cigarettes were called "Camel" perhaps the fags gave off a pungent odour similar to a Camel.

I now know why Camelford in Cornwall is so called. Cornwall has a high Camel population apparently

[Richlist]

Cornwall has a high Camel population apparently

Thanks Melboy....that's solved my brothers problem, seems he'll have to relocate to Cornwall. Sounds great, surfs up.

[Carryon Regardless]

Grampa good tip re going for the rent arrears while progressing the S21, thanks for that.

Now with the tenant C I have specified the particular S8 wording of each clause to be relied on 14 included, but I omitted to include my description of the reason.

With D I have again specified the particular wording of each clause including 14 and I have also described the reason as being anti social behaviour and receiving a Police caution for breaking another t's window with a building block.

Here I see that tenant C could defend as the notice is incorrect,

or would I enjoy success with the other clauses that are correct?

Can I add the reasons for clause 14 now and use the Police reports as evidence?

Tenant D hasn't been seen for a while, I am in hope he has jumped knowing that soon enough he was to be pushed. Maybe HB will enlighten me some when I ring.

If his claim is no longer applicable for my flat I may well assume that to be good reason to believe he has absconded and change the lock.

Otherwise as I see it his S8 notice is in order.

Just for added interest I received a call from tenant C yesterday complaining that tenant F (he describes as my agent as she acts in my interest) keeps calling the Police against him for trivial things. She recorded a conversation below her window where he said he wanted to take a contract out on her (this I learned from tenant F). The Police warned him off but he is threatening to sue me if the calls don't stop. He is still upset that I moved his car last week.

I need operate cautiously when dealing with tenants, but as ex tenants the same caution need not be applied. Soon.

RL I have 2 camels in Wales you can shift, let's call them camel C and camel D.

[Richlist]

RL I have 2 camels in Wales you can shift, let's call them camel C and camel D.

Excellent......that one certainly made me laugh.

[Melboy]

Good one.

COR you have utterly convinced me me never to even think about buying any rental property in Wales. I nearly did 2 years ago I have to say. Looks like I got off very lightly.

I am sort of sniffing around for something to buy but can't find anything suitable at the moment and I havn't in the past 6 months either. I have a really good tenant lined up for it as well which is very frustrating.

[Grampa]

Cor I dont really know the answer as I have only ever used the rent arrears grounds with S8.

But if the forms dont ask for the details of the anti-soial behaviour I would be tempted to run with it and present the evidence on the day or maybe better send it to the court before the hearing so the courts can choose to send a copy to the tenant or not and then see if the tenant puts in a defence or not.